TORA MSA GT Meeting 3 - Autodromo Internazionale del Mugello

Well the actual car has both, so so does ours!

Graftersroom wrote:Great racing throughout I thought. Unfotunately the Viper will be nowhere nears as competitive at Road America.

I hope you're wrong there mate, I'm expecting the viper to run very well round Road America.

BG Blackbird wrote: I hope you're wrong there mate, I'm expecting the viper to run very well round Road America.

I'm currently running 2:11.1XX's, which is way of pace or the BMW's, that's with virtually no aero, but I can't tune like you lads, so the BG Team will probably get it down to 2:08/09's, which will be far more competitive.

i sense the lambo is going to get battered

So is the porsche

So is the Audi. Again.

My replay corrupted, so I can't see my own. Plus I was sprinting downstairs to see who won the 100m final so I might have rushed too much.

Sorry!

I still show 4th place on the second race at Mugello...FYI admins.

When I get back stateside here in a couple of weeks, remind me to make you up my Eclipse Viper if you would like. It is on my storefront if you want to check it out. Unfortunately, no internet access for the xbox while out to sea. Great to read the race recaps from drivers. Keep up the good work!

Cheers Gashi, latest round of TORA TV should be out this week as well

@TORA Staff:

Has there been a result regarding the finishing order of race 2 in Lobby D yet? BloodYCaiN has asked me if anythings been resolved yet or not.
Sorry if I'm asking too much. Just doing my duty as a TORA staff member.

ATR DAN wrote:@TORA Staff:

Has there been a result regarding the finishing order of race 2 in Lobby D yet? BloodYCaiN has asked me if anythings been resolved yet or not.
Sorry if I'm asking too much. Just doing my duty as a TORA staff member.

Anyone? Chris, Duncan, Simon, Louis, Richard, Ian, Matt, Mark?

ATR DAN wrote:

ATR DAN wrote:@TORA Staff:

Has there been a result regarding the finishing order of race 2 in Lobby D yet? BloodYCaiN has asked me if anythings been resolved yet or not.
Sorry if I'm asking too much. Just doing my duty as a TORA staff member.

Anyone? Chris, Duncan, Simon, Louis, Richard, Ian, Matt, Mark?

There is a definite issue here. As previously mentioned, latecy (lag) can cause cars to appear on different parts of the track from one xbox to another (who hasn't had a knock/crash from someone who swears they were nowhere near you?). My gut was to say that you have to take the host's "version" as the exemplar because, well, they're the host, even though I've seen the photo from Cain, and that shows him crossing the line first. It's entirely possible that if you looked at Bli33ard's replay (which unfortunately corrupted) it would show the other car crossing first.

Therefore in this case, the only fair thing to do is to award a dead heat and score both for equal 3rd.

PS - fyi, this was not ignored, but was being discussed amongst the staff and stewards as to how to handle it, as we have to be consistant and deal with any similar incident in the same way if it happens again in future. Patience is a virtue!

That seems like the best possible resolution that you could make.
By the way, sorry for the impatience.

CQR Aero wrote:

ATR DAN wrote:

ATR DAN wrote:@TORA Staff:

Has there been a result regarding the finishing order of race 2 in Lobby D yet? BloodYCaiN has asked me if anythings been resolved yet or not.
Sorry if I'm asking too much. Just doing my duty as a TORA staff member.

Anyone? Chris, Duncan, Simon, Louis, Richard, Ian, Matt, Mark?

There is a definite issue here. As previously mentioned, latecy (lag) can cause cars to appear on different parts of the track from one xbox to another (who hasn't had a knock/crash from someone who swears they were nowhere near you?). My gut was to say that you have to take the host's "version" as the exemplar because, well, they're the host, even though I've seen the photo from Cain, and that shows him crossing the line first. It's entirely possible that if you looked at Bli33ard's replay (which unfortunately corrupted) it would show the other car crossing first.

Therefore in this case, the only fair thing to do is to award a dead heat and score both for equal 3rd.

PS - fyi, this was not ignored, but was being discussed amongst the staff and stewards as to how to handle it, as we have to be consistant and deal with any similar incident in the same way if it happens again in future. Patience is a virtue!

So...we both get points for third? The only thing I don't understand is that...well, I do have the replay even if the hosts was corrupted. Obviously if the hosts replay is corrupt then you would need to use someone elses to make a decision. I would think the other driver conceeding the position would be sufficient for a decision. I'm happy with the decision if its not costing me any points.

I understand the hosts replay is corrupt so we cannot look into that, but the host did take a picture of the results, showing graftersoom finishing ahead via telemetry. This goes with your pics showing you being further ahead.

If graftersroom freely admits you were ahead at the end of that race, I can see a clear decision being made

Ordinarily I would have been inclined to take the hosts version as the exemplar and say "better luck next time". So I'd take the extra point and be happy if I were you. We've already taken a decision to score you both evenly and this is a precedent for the future if a similar situation occurs.

The decision was made after careful consideration, and the thought process was spelled out in my post above. I'd appreciate it if you didn't then question it further trying to put doubt back onto the decision. It's one point you're arguing over, and you've already been awarded it. Do you really want to now start another argument in order to try and get a point removed from Graftersroom?

CMGraphix wrote:I understand the hosts replay is corrupt so we cannot look into that, but the host did take a picture of the results, showing graftersoom finishing ahead via telemetry. This goes with your pics showing you being further ahead.

If graftersroom freely admits you were ahead at the end of that race, I can see a clear decision being made

Actually the results showed our finishing times identical. The game had to put someone in third as there are no ties on Forza

He did a week ago. He saw the pictures and replay and conceeded the position as a respectable driver would. Aero's speaking as if I'm desperately trying to cause confrontation and pull points from people. You can't just say "better luck next time" without using the race data to make a decision. That statement in itself takes this rule driven, simulation, professional racing series website and flushes them down the toilet. Just trying to keep things as accurate as possible while keeping some damn integrity.

CQR Aero wrote:Ordinarily I would have been inclined to take the hosts version as the exemplar and say "better luck next time". So I'd take the extra point and be happy if I were you. We've already taken a decision to score you both evenly and this is a precedent for the future if a similar situation occurs.

The decision was made after careful consideration, and the thought process was spelled out in my post above. I'd appreciate it if you didn't then question it further trying to put doubt back onto the decision. It's one point you're arguing over, and you've already been awarded it. Do you really want to now start another argument in order to try and get a point removed from Graftersroom?

Sorry...but, how is this an argument and who am I arguing with? I didn't know how many points it was over and I don't really see how that's relevant. It's the principal of the situation. In a serious, professional series a point is a point and they're all important. I've been very patient over the past almost two weeks waiting for a decision without anybody saying anything to me about it. No updates, no, we're figuring it out and we'll get back to you. Nobody told me it was being looked into at all and I have asked more than once without a response except for DAN (thank you). As far as I knew I was either being ignored or it was already decided and I was just reminding a staff member to update the points. It's really bothersome when a site staff member belittles the points as if one point doesn't mean anything. One point can make or break a position or series. Frankly, I didnt see the issue in the first place, a replay and images were presented. The associated driver saw the images and conceeded the position. In a court of law the gavel just dropped. This has now been taken way further than it needed to be and now I'm arguing? Graftersroom and I had a great race and I would most certainly never try to take points or a position from him. I clearly said in above post that I was happy with the decision as long as it didnt cost me points. Sorry man but bottom line, I took 3rd, and if you were in my position having someone else tell you that the place and points don't matter it would likely piss you off too.

If there's only one replay available to view a race to make decisions like this, then that's the replay that needs to be used and should be viewed as the bible for final placing decisions unless there is obvious lag in the replay which there wasn't. Not...this replay finish could be a fragment of lag so we won't use it and we'll just let people tie. There are no ties in racing. They're called photo finishes for a reason...because it takes a photo to find out who won.

Once again I would like to thank ATR DAN for helping me out with this and handling the TASCAR wheel situation as a respectful professional.

Bli33ard wrote:My replay corrupted, so I can't see my own. Plus I was sprinting downstairs to see who won the 100m final so I might have rushed too much.

Sorry!

is that your dog in your avatar? Is that a real or photoshop expression? Every time I look at it I laugh...hilarious!!!

CQR Aero wrote:Ordinarily I would have been inclined to take the hosts version as the exemplar and say "better luck next time". So I'd take the extra point and be happy if I were you. We've already taken a decision to score you both evenly and this is a precedent for the future if a similar situation occurs.

The decision was made after careful consideration, and the thought process was spelled out in my post above. I'd appreciate it if you didn't then question it further trying to put doubt back onto the decision. It's one point you're arguing over, and you've already been awarded it. Do you really want to now start another argument in order to try and get a point removed from Graftersroom?

It's nothing personal. I fight for competitive fairness and I fought hard for that spot. End

BloodYCaiN wrote:

Bli33ard wrote:My replay corrupted, so I can't see my own. Plus I was sprinting downstairs to see who won the 100m final so I might have rushed too much.

Sorry!

is that your dog in your avatar? Is that a real or photoshop expression? Every time I look at it I laugh...hilarious!!!

No, it's a picture I posted and he is using it as his avatar