TORA MSA GT Endurance Series - Lap Times

Chris I believe we need to test at every track before we get that 10% handicap.

Chris- post in here what you said in the test-group about the Aston. So everyone understands what and why the Aston may need a grip h/c change

Below is what I posted in the testing thread, but what I have also said, is that this is based only on testing at Sunset at this point, and I want to benchmark it alongside all the other cars in Enduro trim at Catalunya which gives a much better impression thanks to its mix of corner types and straights before making a solid decision on whether a change is actually needed, or if Sunset just happens to play to the Aston's strengths.

CQR Aero wrote:Testing tonight, it was clear that the small performance gap at the top of the times for the Aston is much larger on drag tyres. Like, about a second a lap at Sunset. After testing -35% power, it was obvious that was too harsh, then we tried -10% rear grip because we thought that might force you to put the power down later, but that was essentially like driving a very expensive drift car, so finally tried -10% front grip (-30% power -5% rear) and it was both manageable, and brought the lap times down to about the same gap that the Aston has in Sprint trim.

Just throwing this out there, but I think that we should seriously consider having the Aston on -30% power, -10% front, -5% rear grip for the endurance series, and 30/5/5 for sprint.

I don't know why there seems to be such a difference on drag tyres compared to the rest of the field but there definitely is a noticeable difference. Perhaps because it's a GT1 spec car it has more mechanical grip and handles the reduced grip from the drag tyres better than the other cars.

Thoughts?

(PS - On the current handicap, CQR Daniel was doing 1.29s at Sunset. The top times outside of an Aston seem to be mid 1.30s, and with the extra front grip handicap, Daniel was doing 1.30.3s)

Track: Sunset Peninsula Full
Car: Ford GT Mk7
Time: 1.32.145

CQR Aero wrote:I've been doing some testing with my friends at CQR, and can confirm that the Sprint cars (race tyres) at the handicaps they have are there or there abouts in terms of balance (my times at Catalunya had a spread of 8 tenths from fastest to slowest, Magic's had a spread of 5 tenths). Except maybe the Mosler. Afraid I couldn't get that on the pace at all! Sounds good though!!!!

As long as the same cars aren't faster on all the tracks then that sounds good to me.

Thanks Chris, I wanted to quote it so everyone else knew but my phone wouldn't let me lol

Anyone got some gt4 times and Any tips for tunning with drag tires

SLS AMG GT3
No Tune
1:33.1xx

CQR Aero wrote:Below is what I posted in the testing thread, but what I have also said, is that this is based only on testing at Sunset at this point, and I want to benchmark it alongside all the other cars in Enduro trim at Catalunya which gives a much better impression thanks to its mix of corner types and straights before making a solid decision on whether a change is actually needed, or if Sunset just happens to play to the Aston's strengths.

CQR Aero wrote:Testing tonight, it was clear that the small performance gap at the top of the times for the Aston is much larger on drag tyres. Like, about a second a lap at Sunset. After testing -35% power, it was obvious that was too harsh, then we tried -10% rear grip because we thought that might force you to put the power down later, but that was essentially like driving a very expensive drift car, so finally tried -10% front grip (-30% power -5% rear) and it was both manageable, and brought the lap times down to about the same gap that the Aston has in Sprint trim.

Just throwing this out there, but I think that we should seriously consider having the Aston on -30% power, -10% front, -5% rear grip for the endurance series, and 30/5/5 for sprint.

I don't know why there seems to be such a difference on drag tyres compared to the rest of the field but there definitely is a noticeable difference. Perhaps because it's a GT1 spec car it has more mechanical grip and handles the reduced grip from the drag tyres better than the other cars.

Thoughts?

(PS - On the current handicap, CQR Daniel was doing 1.29s at Sunset. The top times outside of an Aston seem to be mid 1.30s, and with the extra front grip handicap, Daniel was doing 1.30.3s)

Sounds sensible to me Chris.

GT4 BMW M3 Enduro
Sunset Peninsula Full - 1:43:469
Twin Ring Motegi Full - 2:15:3xx
Nurburgring Grand Prix - 2:16:429
Silverstone Grand Prix - 2:10:36x

Toyota MR-S
Sunset Peninsula, 1:41:2XX - 1:41:6XX consistent.

For the drag tires I found softening the ARB's 5 - 10 points helps with sliding especially in high speed corners. Hope this helps!

Milton is kinG wrote:GT4 BMW M3 Enduro
Sunset Peninsula Full - 1:43:469
Twin Ring Motegi Full - 2:15:3xx
Nurburgring Grand Prix - 2:16:429
Silverstone Grand Prix - 2:10:36x

Good stuff Milton, will you be on later for some testing? Ill try help you out with the tuning

Cheers Joe, I've got the gears done perfect for me they feel great and the car feels good but nor sure if its me or the car need improving,I'm doin consitant 1:43:5x but that's 2 sec's slower lol

Sunset Peninsula Full : 1.44.8xx
Twin Ring Motegi Full : 2.14.9xx
Nurburgring Grand Prix : 2.16.1xx
Silverstone Grand Prix : 2.10.3xx

Done in the Porsche Cayman, with the 35% pwr handicap and drag tyres.

Not sure if i can sign up, i cant really commit to all of the races

SRT Viper GT3 -15% Power

Sunset: 1:31:7XX

Haven't done more than 5 laps at a time yet. Looking to get faster by switching Manual With Clutch.

NOOB 032 wrote:SRT Viper GT3 -10% Power

Sunset: 1:31:7XX

Haven't done more than 5 laps at a time yet. Looking to get faster by switching Manual With Clutch.

Its supposed to be -15% for the viper.

I've completed my testing now, and though I don't want to share all my times etc with you (you can do your own testing!!!) I will share the outcomes:

All cars built to spec. All tunes set to "stock". 6 laps of Catalunya GP with Limited damage for Sprint, and Simulation damage for Enduro.


Sprint Trim:

Total Field Spread
0.913

Mean Average Lap Time
1.52.251

Median Average Lap Time
1.52.302


Enduro Trim:

Total Field Spread
0.896

Mean Average Lap Time
1.55.075

Median Average Lap TIme
1.55.047


For those not "au fait" with maths terms, "mean average" is when you add all the figures (times) together, and divide them by the quantity (number of cars). "Median average" is the number in the middle of a range (good for excluding extremes which may skew a mean average). If the two are close, there are no extremes that are negatively effecting the mean average.

These times and averages included the Aston tested in Enduro trim with 30% power, 5% front and 5% rear grip handicaps. It was not found to have a significant advantage, and sits well within the test results from the rest of the cars. Therefore I will not be recommending that the change that I had previously proposed be implemented.

If anyone has any questions about my testing method, or results, please feel free to ask, however I won't be telling you "what's the best/worst car" etc. although I will say that some cars appear to work better in one trim than the other, and vice versa, which is going to make for a very interesting championship!

That's superb Chris, I have total confidence in your testing methodology and analysis

Hehe thanks! That's because you ran a lot of the laps with me!! One thing that also helps to validate my findings, was that CQR MAGiC was setting lap times that consistantly correlated with mine across the cars, despite the fact that he was faster in every car.

Wow your average lap for sprint are a second up on both the SLS and the R8 im testing and i been adjusting the tuning already.

Im cooked!

Edit, hopefully when i get the car to some test sessions i can find some time in places ive not pushed before. Im new to GT Spec cars and finding there is more in the car than im using through most turns.

SnippetyOggy86 wrote:

NOOB 032 wrote:SRT Viper GT3 -10% Power

Sunset: 1:31:7XX

Haven't done more than 5 laps at a time yet. Looking to get faster by switching Manual With Clutch.

Its supposed to be -15% for the viper.

Yea sorry that's what I meant.

Yes, the gap between our times was consistent regardless of car, which pretty much removes the driver equation and leaves you with the baseline car performance.

Also worth noting is that even with a stock tune, every car bar the Mosler was quick enough to make it into the A lobby based on the S9 qualifying times, so that should give people confidence that the speed is there to unlock, whatever car they're in.

Chris - how do those laps on Catalunya compare to Sunset? Are the same cars faster at both tracks or are they close to being reversed (what with one being a speed biased track and the other a handling biased track)?

If the same cars are faster at both then I would have thought said car(s) would need a PI revision.

I wouldn't call Catalunya handling biased, but no, the "same car" (I assume you refer to the Aston) is not the fastest on the list, and in sprint trim is bang in the middle of the times.

CQR Aero wrote:I wouldn't call Catalunya handling biased, but no, the "same car" (I assume you refer to the Aston) is not the fastest on the list, and in sprint trim is bang in the middle of the times.

I meant if any car was, for example, Top 3 on both tracks then it might be worth taking a look at.

Good to know the balance is there. Good job testing them.