2012 ISCC Pro/AM discussion

Ok so a lot of you are posting interest on want to have a Pro and Am class. I want EVERYONE!!!! staff included to voice their oppinion on the matter here please. what do you want to see? a Pro/Am GT and LMP class? Leave it as is and have 2 Challenge classes for GT's and LMP's (Oreca FLM09 for LMPC, BMW Z4 for GTC) or keep the class structure as is and just have a Pro/Am sub category for each one or an idea you want to throw out there. I want to hear everyones oppinion on this and if there is enough people showing interest we'll try to work something out.

So what do you have to say boys?

GTC - Z4, maybe R8 LMS and the ferrari challenge car?
GT's - stock GT2 cars
LMPC - stock LMPC cars
LMP - LMP1 cars and the grandfathered P2 cars.

i think if you get too many categories, you'll not have enough entries to fill them out.

Would be great but wont work there then will be to many classes and its better to have a lobby full of 16 players in 6 lmp 4 LMPC and 6GT thats what we want to do

Duncan wrote:Would be great but wont work there then will be to many classes and its better to have a lobby full of 16 players in 6 lmp 4 LMPC and 6GT thats what we want to do

Yes Duncan and who's to say that it cant be 6 Pro GT cars in one lobby and 6 Am GT cars in another?

But like i said voice an oppinion on here anything goes.

LMP - LMP1-spec cars
LMPC - Stock Oreca FLM09
GT Pro - Normal GT2 cars (BMW, 458, Jag, Ford GT, 430, Panoz)
GT Am - Cars that we brought in (R8 LMS, Z4 GT3, Lotus Evora, etc.)

GT Pro and Am cars are built to the same specs.

Because all the staff (blue and red) agreed that we would have 3 classes as the feed back we had from the previous season idicated that 2 classes would be better due to each class not been split up as much and more actual cars around you would be your class agianst fast P1

We all said that to many classes dosent make great racing and if we split the field up for a few

It should be LMP, LMPC, GTE-PRO, GTE-AM.

TORA needs to come up with the definition of an 'Am' driver too.

We should try to have no more than four classes, preferably no more than three.

I don't see the need for it. We don't have enough members to have 4 classes in one series. It will water it down to a point where there is no point in competing in the championships as there won't be enough people to compete and races will be won by the same people who are racing against 2-3 people per class. It's pointless with the current TORA numbers.

LMP should be for experienced LMP1 drivers who want the challenge of racing in the high powered and grippy cars.

LMPC is ideal for people who have never raced LMP1 before and it gives them the chance to learn how to work at passing traffic in a car that is not as powerful as the LMP1 cars.

GT should be the same as our main GT series. There is always a good spread of skill in the GT class and it creates a good place to have fun racing whilst being passed by the LMP cars.

Having GTC waters it down to much and it not needed.

You could still have a Pro/Am element within GTE as one class. Any drivers who want to enter into a special 'Am Drivers' category, as well as fighting for the overall GTE category could do so, there would not be any difference in machinery between Pro and Am, and teams could have Pro and Am drivers.

That keeps it down to the nice neat three class structure, but still lets those who are off the pace to fight for something.

I raised the question about this in the other thread, and while I don't want to sound like I want to exclude the faster guys here, I did feel that in last year's ISCC there were a couple of us that were consistently 4 or 5 seconds a lap slower than the other cars in our classes. I understand the reasoning of not wanting to split up the field into too many different classes due to the number of entries, but I don't necessarily think it needs to be split up that much. If we stuck with LMP, LMPC, and GTE, and restricted LMPC to the guys that were not fighting for class wins last year or something, I think that would be fair.

I know that barring nearly everyone disconnecting in a race that I won't be fighting for a win and I'm not really trying to engineer a way for me to win races, but there were a couple times last season in LMP2 where I was basically just driving around in circles by myself for an hour. If the faster guys here were kept out of LMPC that would at least allow for good racing between us slower people.

^The purpose behind LMPC is for exactly that. We're strongly encouraging the faster guys to go into LMP and keep LMPC for people who aren't as experienced.

I can understand the desire for an GTE-AM category, but don't see how you decide who is PRO and who is AM?
I disagree with the idea of GTC for 2 reasons, 1 approach speeds between LMP's and GTC would be ridiculous, and 2. excessive watering down
LMP and LMPC seem an ideal set up to me, for the reasons mentioned above

I'm well and truly AM compared to you lot , still level 31 and cannot get a decent win in against anything R3 or higher.

My idea in the pro / am debate would be Pro drivers racing forced in-car, no traction control, no racing line, sim steering etc...

AM drivers have a choice

Conner wrote:^The purpose behind LMPC is for exactly that. We're strongly encouraging the faster guys to go into LMP and keep LMPC for people who aren't as experienced.

As long as that's taken into consideration when accepting entries for the series, then I'll be happy.

honestly, i'd like to stick with LMP, LMPC, and GT for ISCC.

Simplicity is key, no?

Mark wrote:honestly, i'd like to stick with LMP, LMPC, and GT for ISCC.

i agree with this.

narboza22 wrote:

Conner wrote:^The purpose behind LMPC is for exactly that. We're strongly encouraging the faster guys to go into LMP and keep LMPC for people who aren't as experienced.

As long as that's taken into consideration when accepting entries for the series, then I'll be happy.

Agree with this completely and on Narb's other statement that on some races i also was lapping for an hour on my own cus i was hugely out classed by the other drivers in my class. I didn't come 1st as a privateer in ALMS last season cus of wins, i had no chance of winning, i won cus i turned up to every race. Not the best way of winning, i would of rather had podium spots, but a win is a win. but if those 'faster cars were not in LMP2 class then ppl like Narb and myself would stand a chance cus i do think we are closely matched.

but thats another matter, the main point is i agree with mark, keep it LMP, LMPC and GT2.

LMP, LMPC and GTE is definitely the way to go.

But as I said, having some sort of 'Am Cup' within GTE would be quite nice. 'Am Cup' drivers could still fight for overall honours, and there would be no difference between a Pro car and an Am car.

Gives an extra title for people to fight for. It's always a nice feeling to win something.

If a new guys opinion counts for anything I say keep the 3 class structure, and mandate LMPC for rookies and gentleman drivers. I for one intend on running LMPC in 2012 with the hopes of developing my speed enough to run LMP in future seasons.

The LMPC car is brilliant to drive too!

I think 4 classes would work but maybe keep 3 for this season coming up?

Three classes is the way to go, if we had more than three there would be less drivers in each class.

i can remember the 2009 LMS. had the Prototypes, GT1, Gt2, GT3 AND GT4. but that was 'his' idea.....