TORA.US [FM4] Concerns

After gathering some information, I have some concerns in reference to the management of TORA.US. I understand that TORA was created in the UK and they have the right to do with TORA as they see fit. I have held events of my own as the owner of the Touge Battle Network and I can say without a shadow of a doubt that neither I nor any of my colleagues ever had so many issues with connectivity or race/event management. Again, as I stated before, I do understand that TORA and TORA.US are not my businesses to run or manage.

However, my first concern is the management of the lobby. If TORA.US is designated for the American community, why must each lobby/race be hosted by someone in another country. Every race has shown a series of connectivity problems that cause the majority of drivers to experience issues unnecessarily. This problem can easily be solved by having a driver host the lobby/race that is as close to localized to the majority of the drivers locations.

My second concern is driving etiquette. In the real world of racing, if any driver should use their brakes unnecessarily and impede the flow of traffic in a race, said driver(s) can be at risk of losing points, receiving a stop penalty, or possibly risk being black-flagged and asked to leave the race. The same consequences can be applied to unnecessary contact during a race.

My third concern stems from the lack of responsibility to maintaining an adequate timeframe. If any given driver cannot arrive within a timely manner, said driver(s) would not be able to participate in the given race. By waiting for a driver to show up, the efforts of the other drivers that DID arrive on time will be considered wasted. I understand that people have lives outside of the video game world, but that doesn't mean that a handful of individuals have the right to hold an entire race because those drivers are unable to manage time properly.

My fourth and final concern at this time REALLY made itself apparent at round two of the TORA.US Touring Masters Event. If any driver sees another approaching for a pass, the leading driver has the right to attempt to block ONLY ONCE. At which point, if the chasing driver is able to perform a pass without hindering the leading driver, they may do so. Multiple drivers ignored this and proceed to block others repeatedly causing damage to the other cars. That behavior is supposed to be met with either a stop-penalty or be removed from the race completely.

TORA.US has so much potential to do very well for itself, but without PROPER management, this division will crumble very quickly due to irresponsible choices that could be managed better. I have heard complaints from drivers and spectators alike and I wanted to voice these concerns to help improve what could very EASILY be a solution to the desires of those that want to race, but have no capital or resources to do so. I hope this post is met well as I truly wish for this division to grow the way I know it could.

Ok I'm not commenting on the last point because I have yet to see it on the replay
however, 1) this is Mikey's series and I was asked to run it because as a Marshall it is IMPOSSIBLE for me to run a GMT/BSt based race at 5am in the morning the following day. And the reason someone from Britain was hosting Lobby B and Solar Lobby A was because Mikey ASKED them to. If British/Australian drivers aren't allowed to host TORA US then no Americans should be able to run British races, there's always two faces to the same coin...

2) I said I was happy to miss qualifying because I knew if people waited we would be behind, and I didn't want that. I would happily have started last and have the event run on time instead of (eg) starting on pole and being an hour behind. But, people did a good thing and waited for me and that's not good enough for others. But DO NOT hold mr accountable for the delay.and you talk about not being able to manage time properly? I didn't decide to drop my girlfriend off half an hour before the race, he work called 45 minutes before the race was due to start and we couldn't control that.

So you know what, after yesterday's bitching all round I'm done. You have two options.
1) you (everyone) can turn up to races, cut the bitching and enjoy why we do this
or 2) walk

However, The lobby hosts are either Race marshals to help out Or people who have had experience in doing so.

If a person who is hosting isn't from the US then sorry there doing something to help you guys have a evening of racing?
Dont like it? Offer to host. Simple.

Im sorry me and Erebus tried our best Yesterday to do the races and best we could i didnt have access to the google documents so i couldnt do the Qualifying procedure correctly anyways, i dont have access so we would of had to wait for erebus to come back anyways, as for the US/UK Based stuff, i happily joined this series shared my Tunes from when this Event was a TCR Event and tried to get more people in on it, if people wanna stop non American People doing this then, w.e

as Erebus stated with his bottom 2 comments i stand by fully, i will also take down my Tunes for everything including this Series, and be done with this, as this is pathetic and really uncalled for, we tried our best and we did last week and all we get is people bitching and moaning at us, when we try and run this to the best of our abilities and it does seem, like the Non American people are getting Pushed out of the Series, i will be running Infineon and so will Akihirro and hopefully Erebus but if this bitching and moaning continues no doubt all off us will go out the Series cause me myself cant be arsed to listen you all moaning constantly

Also ErebusV8 also does all the Google Docs for Qualifying and Racing and does all the Finalizing of Positions and points within the Standings.

Case Closed

Hello SpeedDemon

Firstly let me welcome you to TORA and thank you for choosing to race here.

Lobby hosts are normally chosen by willingness and trust, being a TORA marshal can be a stressful job so its not everyone cup of tea + with TORA being a well known online racing organization we don't let just anyone run our lobbies.

Connections can be a great pain, a pain we wish would just disappear, but sadly it wont and I can assure we try our very best to deal with any connection issues - if that means trying another host, splitting lobbies or at worse asking a driver to leave if their connection is still bad.

About your second point it is impossible for us to steward a live lobby to deal with driving standards there and then. All drivers are advised to read the sporting regs before racing at TORA

http://forums.theonlineracingassociation.com/t12061-tora-2013-14-sporting-regulations-19-11-2013

Jumping to your 4th point, TORA have a committed Stewarding team for both Forza 4 and Forza 5 (new for 2015). If you are unhappy with any on track driving or see any rules being broken, please do not hesitate to enter a Stewards Investigation within 36 hours of the event finishing. -

http://forums.theonlineracingassociation.com/t13112-tora-steward-inquiry-submission-form

To your point concerning timeframes, all Marshals and race drivers do there very to make the events run as bang on time as possible. Normally we use a 3 invite rule that if a driver does not come into a lobby or make any contact with a host, we will run the lobby without them. This comes drivers a good amount of time to get in with hosts sending out invites 15-30 minutes before the event start time.

TORA US is a new and exciting adventure for TORA we are working hard to get right as we care about our overseas members as much as the ones in the UK/Europe. It made take time to adjust and 'nail it', but we want to thank everyone for their support of  TORA/TORA US

If you any more questions/worries please PM myself or any re/blue member

FranchittiFan (Head Steward)

I have a solution to these issues. If you guys are feeling frustrated and you feel that your efforts are going unappreciated, please let me know and I am more than happy to utilize what resources I have at my disposal to assist in your endeavors. I truly mean this. I have hosted events before and, even though I am unable to host any event at this time or in the near future, I can ask for volunteers that know what they are doing.

SpeedDemonZ12 wrote:I have a solution to these issues. If you guys are feeling frustrated and you feel that your efforts are going unappreciated, please let me know and I am more than happy to utilize what resources I have at my disposal to assist in your endeavors. I truly mean this. I have hosted events before and, even though I am unable to host any event at this time or in the near future, I can ask for volunteers that know what they are doing.

Solutions for Connectivity and TimeFrame cant be helped dude

the stewarding part can not be done as all Stewards are Split from Countries and another thing is a Steward will not just jump in a Lobby to Spectate we have alot more things to be worrying about then sitting in a Lobby Watching People and giving Warnings on the Spot as we have the Appeal Option when a Verdict has been reached, so this would not work either.

if you have any Solutions u would like to put across for the Stewarding Section Please send them to FranchitiFan as he is the Head Steward of TORA and he will more then likely take it on board and speak with the rest of the Stewards, but this is not a promise the solution you give us will be put into place

I preapologize for my grammar...

First... I believe in what mikey and erebus are doing!!!

Tora us doubled in one week unexpectedly and put erebus in a bind add OLL... Or Off Line Life and a perfect poo storm happens. Sprinkle with a new host sharing band width poof lobby host /another delay...

I am all about solutions and progress
So as many of you know I race /host/drive slow/upset/ rarely lag*/ have 4 year's experience in multiple race weeks.... What I can offer is Prompt roominvites, keeping to the time schedule ,
Things I can not do results... Basically any form of data transfer as I am a cpu ratard, go fast, do a handspring

Now let's get together and finish this thing How it should be ....
The "Merican" way
Sideways, upside onfire, then when you get out with a smile on your face and say WHERE IS THE NEXT TORA US RACE?

Next Week Everything should be back on Schedule, lets just try put everything thats happened behind us and get on with this.

Speed Demon, as the event coordiantor for this series, as well as all FM4 events, US or otherwise, let me explain a few things that have suddenly popped up...

In the past, during FM4's heyday (before XB1/FM5 split the community) we had a core of 6-10 American TORA Marshals (race/series hosts) and a maximum of maybe 17-18 entries for any prime time US events. Since the split, I can count exactly, um, yeah... ZERO American TORA FM4 Marshals.

So, I recruited Erebus, yes he's an Aussie but its noon there as opposed to the Midnight to 5am timeframe that most TORA events are run, so he finally had a series happening when he's actually AWAKE. Thing is, going off from TORA's history of American series, we honestly expected maybe 10 people to actually show up, with hopes for maybe 14. When I saw 22 had signed in as of Tuesday, less than 24 hours til race time, I had to scramble to find hosting assistance, and thanks to Midnite Rider and WhosJohnGalt for stepping up to help.

So, TORA is now well aware that we are in need of additional American FM4 Marshals, and I am now personally on a mission to fill that need.

On to the second bit of the OP, driving standards...

Watching the first round at Mugello, I was rather alarmed by some of the blocking tactics that I witnessed, but since there were no official Steward inquiries filed, I let it slide w/o a word, as I do not want to micro manage the driving styles of anyone, and it is Touring Cars, and if anyone has seen Jason Plato in BTCC, then you should know that a bit of contact is part of the game.

The divebomb passes and aggressive blocking tactics WILL without a doubt cause some tempers to flare... but if you do either, aggressive passing attempts or aggressive blocking, do not get your panties in a wad when the inevitable happens and your competition dishes out whatever it is you have been asking for all along. At most, I may offer you a tissue for your tears.

In other words, live by the bumper, die by the bumper.

However, if you do indeed race clean and fair, then get wrecked by someone else's aggression, then your concerns will be dealt with appropriately. We take pride in organizing clean and fair racing for all, and sanctions will go out to those who race in any other manner besides clean as can be.

Just to throw this out there, I have a super fast connection, have ran series for 4 years now and am willing to host. I am an American on the East Coast, as some West Coasters have issues. Just let me know when you need help! I always end up in B Lobby anyway! Lmao. But Roscoe, Camshaft, TyrannicCymbals and a few others on here have ran in my series races before. They are usually well ran, and as much as possible, by the book.

Solar Flar3 wrote:Im sorry me and Erebus tried our best Yesterday to do the races and best we could i didnt have access to the google documents so i couldnt do the Qualifying procedure correctly anyways, i dont have access so we would of had to wait for erebus to come back anyways, as for the US/UK Based stuff, i happily joined this series shared my Tunes from when this Event was a TCR Event and tried to get more people in on it, if people wanna stop non American People doing this then, w.e

as Erebus stated with his bottom 2 comments i stand by fully, i will also take down my Tunes for everything including this Series, and be done with this, as this is pathetic and really uncalled for, we tried our best and we did last week and all we get is people bitching and moaning at us, when we try and run this to the best of our abilities and it does seem, like the Non American people are getting Pushed out of the Series, i will be running Infineon and so will Akihirro and hopefully Erebus but if this bitching and moaning continues no doubt all off us will go out the Series cause me myself cant be arsed to listen you all moaning constantly

Also ErebusV8 also does all the Google Docs for Qualifying and Racing and does all the Finalizing of Positions and points within the Standings.

Case Closed

t
They didn't let you host did they Solar there your issue guys lol only joking haha

Yes sir he was the host... Then he lagged out twice

Wont Happen Again cause that really pissed me off so dont think me and Akihirro will be trying that again haha

Lol!  It did help the points battle, I am sure!

xIcemanx41 wrote:Lol!  It did help the points battle, I am sure!

just sitting 1 point ahead of Moesavy in the standings atm gonna be a battle to the end this is

I will be watching from mid pack! Lol

May the Best TEAM WIN!!!
USA USA USA!!!

After reading each post, I'm so very glad to have signed up with TORA! I may have been blasted for my lack if deeper understanding, for which I meant no disrespect, and I deeply apologize for that. It's good to see a community that is willing to work together in the manner of which everyone does. This is a rare thing to find these days. I only wish to help in any way that I can. If more American Marshalls are needed, I would like to assist in the search for those that are trustworthy for the task. I am currently unable to either host a lobby or sign up as an official in any capacity as I am experiencing nothing short of a crisis in my life, though I sincerely wish I could! I will do whatever it is that I can to help despite my circumstances to help further the goals of TORA.US should anyone require it.

Cheers SpeedDemon.

Like I said, the major issue that you brought up was also noticed by me, less than 24 hours before race day. The thing is, I have received lots of offers to help host events since your concerns went public, for that I owe you one, and am grateful to the TORA US community as a whole.

Let's never get caught out by being short staffed again!

ROSCOEpCOTRAIN wrote:Yes sir he was the host... Then he lagged out twice

So we blaming Solar for poor hosting again lol I'm messing again haha just like picking the banter on young Solar lol.