Re: TORA MSA GT Endurance Series - Lap Times

by **Biggsy tv** Mon 24 Dec 2012 - 20:12

CQR MAGiC wrote:That's superb Chris, I have total confidence in your testing methodology and analysis

Amazing

by Ax4x Kane Mon 24 Dec 2012 - 21:32

CMGraphix wrote:
CQR MAGiC wrote:That's superb Chris, I have total confidence in your testing methodology and analysis

Amazing

Haha! The Irony...

by Markius Fox Mon 24 Dec 2012 - 23:37

1:35.736 in SRT Viper. Virgin run. She feels good.

by BG Wumba Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 2:20

Defconluke wrote:Chris - how do those laps on Catalunya compare to Sunset? Are the same cars faster at both tracks or are they close to being reversed (what with one being a speed biased track and the other a handling biased track)?

If the same cars are faster at both then I would have thought said car(s) would need a PI revision.

Exactly my thoughts, and Catalunya definitely leans more towards the handling side rather than a power track...

by Markius Fox Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 5:20

~~1:34.997~~ ~~1:34.025~~ 1:33.978

by XPR Roadrunner Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 6:26

Good to hear you are finally behind the wheel of it! Keep at it and you'll get faster. I suggest running laps at catalunya so you can see the difference with the race tires.

by Beanz Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 9:43

BG Wumba wrote:
Defconluke wrote:Chris - how do those laps on Catalunya compare to Sunset? Are the same cars faster at both tracks or are they close to being reversed (what with one being a speed biased track and the other a handling biased track)?

If the same cars are faster at both then I would have thought said car(s) would need a PI revision.

Exactly my thoughts, and Catalunya definitely leans more towards the handling side rather than a power track...

I disagree, it's kind of 50/50. As long as you get the car working on the corner or on the straights (or both, obviously), you'll get a quick time round there.

by **CQR Aero** Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 10:39

Put it this way; you have nothing to complain about when comparing the Aston and the Z4.

The Beemer was faster than the Aston in both specs, and fastest of all in Endurance trim.

by Beanz Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 10:51

CQR Aero wrote:Put it this way; you have nothing to complain about when comparing the Aston and the Z4.

The Beemer was faster than the Aston in both specs, and fastest of all in Endurance trim.

Not disagreeing with you there Chris, I'm not complaining or even commenting on either cars' speed, I was disagreeing with Wumba's statement about Catalunya's characteristics.

by **CQR Aero** Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 11:17

Sorry, I missed out a word - "complain/worry"

by **Koenigsegg R** Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 13:18

BG Beanz wrote:
BG Wumba wrote:
Defconluke wrote:Chris - how do those laps on Catalunya compare to Sunset? Are the same cars faster at both tracks or are they close to being reversed (what with one being a speed biased track and the other a handling biased track)?

If the same cars are faster at both then I would have thought said car(s) would need a PI revision.

Exactly my thoughts, and Catalunya definitely leans more towards the handling side rather than a power track...
I disagree, it's kind of 50/50. As long as you get the car working on the corner or on the straights (or both, obviously), you'll get a quick time round there.

Catalunya is not a true handling track because of the long straight. But it's leaning more towards handling than speed. However, Catalunya does favour mid-engined cars.

by TG Wormburner Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 14:12

Catalunya is a handling track Thom. It's more handling oriented than nearly every track in the game.

by **Koenigsegg R** Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 15:24

Yes, it's a handling track. I said that. But tracks like Mugello, Maple Valley, Bernese Alps, Infineon and Laguna Seca are more handling oriented than Catalunya.

by **Ax4x Cowboy** Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 16:01

Catalunya is the same as Mugello except Mugello has a longer straight.

The Endurance Series doesn't even go to Catalunya so any times from there are almost useless.

by **CQR Aero** Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 16:54

Defconluke wrote:The Endurance Series doesn't even go to Catalunya so any times from there are almost useless.

I wasn't trying to see how well the cars went at one of the series venues, I was trying to see if they were balanced on what I would call a balanced circuit. You can always do your own testing if you don't like what I've done or the way I've done it. Radical suggestion I know but....

We'll never get a concensus of opinion here because someone will always have a different one (opinion), so I suggest we move on.

by **Ax4x Cowboy** Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 18:17

It is my opinion that the cars should be balanced for where they are going to be used and other tracks should be unimportant.

If, by coincidence, they are balanced at other tracks too then so be it.

by RumbleBee 392 Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 18:26

Catalunya is the second track in the series...

by Ax4x Chaddy Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 18:49

Very glad the Aston will keep the 5% at the front, thank you for doing that testing Chris.

by BG Wumba Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 19:08

CQR Aero wrote:Below is what I posted in the testing thread, but what I have also said, is that this is based only on testing at Sunset at this point, and I want to benchmark it alongside all the other cars in Enduro trim at Catalunya which gives a much better impression thanks to its mix of corner types and straights before making a solid decision on whether a change is actually needed, or if Sunset just happens to play to the Aston's strengths.

CQR Aero wrote:Testing tonight, it was clear that the small performance gap at the top of the times for the Aston is much larger on drag tyres. Like, about a second a lap at Sunset. After testing -35% power, it was obvious that was too harsh, then we tried -10% rear grip because we thought that might force you to put the power down later, but that was essentially like driving a very expensive drift car, so finally tried -10% front grip (-30% power -5% rear) and it was both manageable, and brought the lap times down to about the same gap that the Aston has in Sprint trim.

Just throwing this out there, but I think that we should seriously consider having the Aston on -30% power, -10% front, -5% rear grip for the endurance series, and 30/5/5 for sprint.

I don't know why there seems to be such a difference on drag tyres compared to the rest of the field but there definitely is a noticeable difference. Perhaps because it's a GT1 spec car it has more mechanical grip and handles the reduced grip from the drag tyres better than the other cars.

Thoughts?

(PS - On the current handicap, CQR Daniel was doing 1.29s at Sunset. The top times outside of an Aston seem to be mid 1.30s, and with the extra front grip handicap, Daniel was doing 1.30.3s)

Read all the posts after this, and the mean times and averages still won't make up for the fact the Aston will be significantly faster round Sunset, so at one moment it's a 'noticeable difference' then you decide not to make a change and say 'It was not found to have a significant advantage' but you said it did round Sunset!? bewildering... Shocked

by Beanz Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 19:15

William just leave it. If Chris, Mark and others have tested it thoroughly I trust them enough to think that's the right decision.

by Guest Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 19:15

I still don't get why the Aston is causing such a stir. Because Dan is one of the quickest drivers that should be penalised? Sounds just like the reasoning behind the Jag PI drop all over again. I'm waiting for everyone to see how quick he was in the lambo that will be next to be complained about.

by Ax4x Kane Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 19:52

+1. don't people know that CQR are #FastInAnyCar? Too many people complaining before anything has even started. Enjoy the racing, not the winning. (unless you can do both Wink

)

by Beanz Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 21:38

Kilroy8 wrote:+1. don't people know that CQR are #FastInAnyCar? Too many people complaining before anything has even started. Enjoy the racing, not the winning. (unless you can do both )

TORA MSA GT Endurance Series - Lap Times - Page 4 Whssign

by TG Axiom Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 21:53

Anyways back on topic to laptimes now? ...

by TG Wormburner Tue 25 Dec 2012 - 23:44

F4H Koenigsegg wrote:Yes, it's a handling track. I said that. But tracks like Mugello, Maple Valley, Bernese Alps, Infineon and Laguna Seca are more handling oriented than Catalunya.

Maple Valley requires less downforce and a faster car than Catalunya or Mugello. Mugello is more of a handling track than Catalunya because you have to carry more momentum. Catalunya has a few more corners that deal with acceleration. The R classes could be slightly different but for the most part you still run less downforce there. It also has one of the fastest straights on the game going down the hill. It is more handling oriented than something like Le Mans but it still is. That was my point. It was a little different for some reason in FM3.

Also, can someone be so nice as to tell me what the basis for the GT4 cars are so I know what to put on Joe's paint. I don't want to put a bunch of Japanese sponsors or American sponsors on a car series that is based in Europe. It wouldn't make any sense and I am picky. Thanks.

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