Championship Discussion

Aye, I'm working on my requested cars as we speak, though if you assume 2 car choices per championship, that's 9 cars so far, with probably not many vinyl re-uses as I'm aiming for near-replica schemes! (LMS, CER, TCM, GT3 + Mini). God help me if we end up doing the rally ones too!

I'm aiming for some replicas in a couple of series but THR's sponsors demand exposure so a few of them will be appearing on all the cars. It's worked quite well tbh

jenson09 wrote:I'm aiming for some replicas in a couple of series but THR's sponsors demand exposure so a few of them will be appearing on all the cars. It's worked quite well tbh

This is what I'm envisaging too - a "look-alike" if you like, with a few sponsors replaced by our own. (Picture a BTCC RAC sponsored BMW, with the "RAC" switched to "WWR" as a crude example).

I don't want to rock the boat or anything, and obviously I still have the opportunity to change car choice; however, the Z06 seems (to me) to have been too agressively "nerfed" - I'm now struggling to make lap times anywhere near being "on-pace". This may well be down to lack of driver skill(!!) though I wouldn't expect to be this far off really, and having a so-so driver in an already lower PI'd car probably isn't helping, but I'd really prefer to race in this car if I can! Perhaps if this still appears to be the case on media day, would there be any room for adjustment to address this?

In order to gain a genuine 'official' view point on all of this as stipulated by myself on numerous occasions, TORA will administer additional equalisation measures for cars that are felt to be over performing following the Official Tests and Media Day.

When will the first one be Matt? Would be good to have an oganised test...

the first is scheduled for 17th of january at Silverstone Intl

think it may be an idea to have a few in decemeber

Why? there's more than a month between the media day and the first meeting. thats more than enough time to fix some small pi things ect.

Nightrider stop talking down to people just because you have had a different point of view about cars and the such. Its unproffesional and rude.

Simple fact. The more official testing the better. I don't think anyone will be happy to hear that their car has been dropped or the PI has been changed with 2 weeks to go before the first race. Have more official tests over the next 2 months and you will get a feel for the car list and PIs and can make adjustments to suit. And please don't use the words 'set in stone' or 'final spec' or 'o more changes' until the first race ok

Anyone can arrange testing before hand as always.
We will try and get some 'official timings' set up for late December early Jan. But with people prepping for Xmas etc its a lil tougher than usual to get everyone together.
Having said that the best thig to do would be to post up the testing times to your dedicated thread if/when you do any bigger tests.
More like F1 that way

Richy59 wrote:Nightrider stop talking down to people just because you have had a different point of view about cars and the such. Its unproffesional and rude.

Simple fact. The more official testing the better. I don't think anyone will be happy to hear that their car has been dropped or the PI has been changed with 2 weeks to go before the first race. Have more official tests over the next 2 months and you will get a feel for the car list and PIs and can make adjustments to suit. And please don't use the words 'set in stone' or 'final spec' or 'o more changes' until the first race ok

im not "talking down" to anyone. just offering my insight. to mee a month seems like a long time, and after every unofficial test i offer feedback to other staff, and im sorry if ive seemed angry, rude these pass few days, there is other personal stuff stressing me out, i love this community, and would do anything for the betterment of it, even if i have to drop of the gtc

XTI Nightrider wrote:

Richy59 wrote:Nightrider stop talking down to people just because you have had a different point of view about cars and the such. Its unproffesional and rude.

Simple fact. The more official testing the better. I don't think anyone will be happy to hear that their car has been dropped or the PI has been changed with 2 weeks to go before the first race. Have more official tests over the next 2 months and you will get a feel for the car list and PIs and can make adjustments to suit. And please don't use the words 'set in stone' or 'final spec' or 'o more changes' until the first race ok

im not "talking down" to anyone. just offering my insight. to mee a month seems like a long time, and after every unofficial test i offer feedback to other staff, and im sorry if ive seemed angry, rude these pass few days, there is other personal stuff stressing me out, i love this community, and would do anything for the betterment of it, even if i have to drop of the gtc

Yep, end of story > back to the GT3 yeh

Hiya Jenson, can you please clarify your statement for me below. Do you mean wiyth TORA tyres and wings or complete untouched out the box?

"Re: Non-official Testing 29/11/09 20:00 GMT
by jenson09 Yesterday at 9:14 am

If you tested all cars with stock tune they are remarkably similar. "

Cheers ears

My guess is Fully Upgraded to the PI as sated, but with no tuning done to the set up of the cars. That is how we tested the car list last season.

when you build the car to the PI but without adding your own 'tune' to it.
Sorry if I wasn't clear.
I've been testing the Viper all morning then doubling it up with my two other GT3 spec cars and both are quicker than it!
So to be honest I'd be putting it down the tunes people add after the build that makes the difference. But isn't that always the way

cheers for the swift responses. Just wanted to do some testing and make sure I had understood before hand.

"I've been testing the Viper all morning then doubling it up with my two other GT3 spec cars and both are quicker than it! So to be honest I'd be putting it down the tunes people add after the build that makes the difference. But isn't that always the way "

Wow, that surpises me. Looks like the way the PI is built up to has a huge impact on performance also. Early on in the pre season I was testing the Porsche Rs around SilverStone, was enjoying it and thinking god i am good!!! lol Then PLOW butcher appeared in the same car and preceeded to go 2 secs a lap quicker. Now, this made me swiftly look at my build, and I quickly swapped to a different parts make up with no tune and ended up half a second slower than Butcher!!!

I am happy to send my Viper for you to test against these other GT3's if you wish. Might be the build resulting in the diferences, and if not, then its great news.

Yeah no probs mate. I try to get back to people soon as I can

should have the Viper ;O) Looking forward to your results. Catalunya is where I've mainly run it.

i want some of your guy's tunes lol. im still stuck about two seconds slower

I'm really not sure where to put this post; timing, regulation clarification, or discussion, but I'll put it here as it eventually pertains to the rules regarding PI, specifically for my team's preferred car. Note; "preferred", not "best" or any other name. I have my heart set on racing the Corvette, yet we have run it tonight in a test session with other TORA drivers in their GT3 cars and have found that at PI650 it is on average, 1.5 to 2 seconds per lap slower than the next fastest car. We certainly weren't sandbagging in any way - we were driving cleanly, as fast as humaly possible, with a good build and tune for that PI - the car handles OK, it has a straight line speed that matches the best out there too, however it takes too long to get there as you have to be super late putting the power down.
As an experiment, we built a car to PI660, kept practically the same setup, hower the extra 10PI allowed for 2 critical upgrades - adjustable springs, and wider-than-stock tyres. So you can see - no increase in bhp, torque, or weight reduction, merely stability.
The difference this has made has brought the car into line with the others. We tested it alongside general tso's Alfa 8c, DJH's F430, and short shift's SL65. It had no significant advantage over the others, but started to be far more competitive - it could match the straight-line speed of the Ferrari, and still get round corners! We only set one lap time faster than anyone else's - at Mugello, in the whole session, however there were some races where our times were all within the same second (1:53.x).
I would like to propose that the PI for at least this car, and potentially following similar testing, others currently limited to 650, are raised to 660 if it makes them more competitive without significant advantage. I'd be more than happy to do further testing with those who make these decisions as I'd hope this proposal won't be dismissed out of hand.

Sincerely


Chris

I think your right in what your saying about how upgrading from 650 to 660 will not change bhp unless that is something that people want to build for. At 650 from what I have been hearing the cars just don't quite have the edge to get them competitive with the 670 cars. As I said before, in regards to the viper, a 10 pi change can be made with lighter wheels, lighter flywheel, lighter driveshaft will bring it 10 pi up. As you said crucially the 10 extra pi gave you room to breath to stick wider tyres on and the adjustable springs. That evened out you car with the rest. It was still capped at power because any more and you wouldn't have kept it in the limit and the grip was increased to maek it competitive with the rest of the field. The Porka RS is too light and too slow and 650 but maybe 10 pis worth of power would be really help that car. yes, it could be argued that people will only use the 10 pi extra to rebuild their cars to gain more power, but the trade off is handling. Every competitor is allowed to do it, its a risk that is run in a series like this where you cannot moderate the fine details of the cars. As I have seen in the past most memebers will build cars to be competitive, not just cars that are bullets in a straight line and boats in the corners. I think we have more sense that that. The same can be said for the superleggera, alough I think its more like a cross of the Vette and the Porka. imo from what I have been heardin a 10 pi increase to the 650 cars would even out the field and would nail the car list on the head...apart from the viper

btw, have you tried the ZR1? Its in the 670 limit...

With the testing series Im setting up over the next few Sundays and Tuesdays this is what we will look at.
Lets start looking t those now please.

Great news, and a very welcome "open mind" from both of you. I'm not looking to have a car that will annihilate everything else in the field; never have. After all, where is the fun in that? The fun for me, lies in clean, close racing. "Ding dong battles" as I like to call them!!!
Before I joined WWR ("Wire to Wire Racing" for the informed), I always used to think WWR stood for Wheel to Wheel Racing - something that appealed to me greatly, and still does!
I'm looking forward to this new season so much I can hardly wait. Here's hoping that we can work out the PI issue in the near future, then our team will be set to take on all contenders!