WIX Racing TCC - Build Rules

This 'dilemma' has been seen time and time again here on TORA. Way back around the times TCC was born, the team PLOW was receiving a lot of negative views and criticism because they were destroying in the championships. This caused other drivers to complain and start bringing up the whole BOP argument with the cars the front runners in the series were using. Multiple people have already tested the BMW, and even gone to the lengths of making a video (Thanks CQR MAGiC) to prove that the cars are balanced. It has been said since the beginning of the season that the BMW is the hardest car to not only drive, but tune. At this point it comes down to driver skill, time put into tuning/practicing, and experience in Forza. Most of the guys you see running at the top have played Forza for YEARS, in addition to many other racing sims. A lot of these said drivers also specialize in FWD touring cars like some of the CQR lads etc. I really don't know what encourages people to continue bashing these drivers and bringing up the BOP. It gets tiring seeing these 'arguments' on the forums, even more when a teammate of mine gets personally called out and disrespected. With this being said, now it is up to the staff to see if BOP should be made. Let's just all get back to what we come here to do.. Race.

To be honest AscarI I take a bit of offence from what you said before saying is anyone actually fast driving the BMW. I think that is a stupid thing to say really

"Is anyone fast in the bmw" I might not be getting the same lap times as you lot but at least I can keep my car in the limits of the track

Ok fellas i agree the car needs changing but no slandering other players or causing/making offence
Cupid , mike and noodle messege has been got we will sort it

You may want to re read the rules DizzyCupid, two wheels must remain inside the white line, you see when two wheels go outside that is called taking the apex and using the kerbs which is all part of racing. Try it you may find more time. Happy racing!

P.S to everyone at TORA, do we really need to do this with every series, every year? It's got really boring...

All I'm saying now is there was no need for Ascari to say what he did

Sub Zero Nova 2 wrote:Ok fellas i agree the car needs changing but no slandering other players or causing/making offence
Cupid , mike and noodle messege has been got we will sort it

Us Honda drivers want more tire width to control the torque steer.... It's not my fault I have a heavy right foot...

montessa mike wrote:All I'm saying now is there was no need for Ascari to say what he did

Actually, there was a need to say it. The cars are balanced, and your inability to drive one of them doesn't refute that. That's why you have an option to choose cars in the first place...

No I mean saying there are no good drivers in the BMW so what he is saying is every driver in the BMW is a crap driver

FranchittiFan wrote:Staff are aware of drivers concerns with the BMW, we would like to ask that the community doesn't argue about who is quicker than who, it doesn't help anyone and causes anger + can be distressing to some members.

That is all.

Exactly

montessa mike wrote:No I mean saying there are no good drivers in the BMW so what he is saying is every driver in the BMW is a crap driver

That's is so far out of context dude...

He said are there even any GOOD drivers in the BMW

No, what he's saying is that blaming the BMW on a poor race isn't viable because it has been proven to be just as competitive as the other cars. The staff are concerned with making the cars as equal as possible, and when multiple people claim a car is too slow while most of our notorious participants assure everyone that it isn't, it makes things way more complicated than they need to be.

I know that but I feel that some of the people in this conversation are treating the lower drivers in the lower teams like they are nothing in some ways not all teams but some

I am going to put my two cents in here.

This is not something to really argue over, after all, as FranchittiFan said, the staff are looking into it, but CQR MAGiC proved that the BMW is a competitive car in the right hands. This is assuming that testing took place with the same driver(s).

The phrase "A bad workman blames his tools" would do well to go refreshed here I think.

It's not the car that's the problem. It's the driver. If you're not happy with it then try something else. It's just common sense.

I understand that the builds got changed before race 1 and it mustn't have been easy to adapt but the cars all have strong and weak points, there is no optimum car for this championship and as far as I see it, the builds are pretty fair.

On car performance alone, these cars are equal. In terms of who is driving it and how much effort they put in, determines what you get out. You reap what you sow.

That's only my two cents and I complain the Hondas were too quick. No, it's just the CQR are just quick in a Honda, Haydie T proved that the Mercedes is a quick car and can beat the Honda.

Look, the car isn't the problem, it's the person driving. I can say that safely after Road Atlanta that the cars are fine. I hated the BMW when I tested it, so I didn't pick it.

A bad workman blames his tools, a lot like a bad driver blames the car. I understand when there are situations when the car is at fault but this isn't one of them.

That's only my two cents though. Make of it what you will, rest assured the staff are looking at it and people getting on at each other isn't good for yourself, others and the reputation of the site... Keep it civil and just rest assured.

CQR CHRiS wrote:

Sub Zero Nova 2 wrote:Ok fellas i agree the car needs changing but no slandering other players or causing/making offence
Cupid , mike and noodle messege has been got we will sort it

Us Honda drivers want more tire width to control the torque steer.... It's not my fault I have a heavy right foot...

sure its not vtec kicking in?

LMP Dragon wrote:I am going to put my two cents in here.

This is not something to really argue over, after all, as FranchittiFan said, the staff are looking into it, but CQR MAGiC proved that the BMW is a competitive car in the right hands. This is assuming that testing took place with the same driver(s).

The phrase "A bad workman blames his tools" would do well to go refreshed here I think.

It's not the car that's the problem. It's the driver. If you're not happy with it then try something else. It's just common sense.

I understand that the builds got changed before race 1 and it mustn't have been easy to adapt but the cars all have strong and weak points, there is no optimum car for this championship and as far as I see it, the builds are pretty fair.

On car performance alone, these cars are equal. In terms of who is driving it and how much effort they put in, determines what you get out. You reap what you sow.

That's only my two cents and I complain the Hondas were too quick. No, it's just the CQR are just quick in a Honda, Haydie T proved that the Mercedes is a quick car and can beat the Honda.

Look, the car isn't the problem, it's the person driving. I can say that safely after Road Atlanta that the cars are fine. I hated the BMW when I tested it, so I didn't pick it.

A bad workman blames his tools, a lot like a bad driver blames the car. I understand when there are situations when the car is at fault but this isn't one of them.

That's only my two cents though. Make of it what you will, rest assured the staff are looking at it and people getting on at each other isn't good for yourself, others and the reputation of the site... Keep it civil and just rest assured.

Considering i was 1 second of my fast time in the BMW i dont think its driver error.....it is quite crap...

Guys - end of please. There is now the mid-season 'holiday' during which announcements regarding changes to BoP will be made.
These will be done in conjunction with key players in each car affected and the TORA BoP testing team.
Any changes made will be fully tested and will be in place for the second half of the season.

Debate ends now please.

If it helps at all, I just managed a 1:24.946 on Road Atlanta after spending about 10 minutes with the car. Get crafty with your tune and you'll see results. Even I overlooked the key to making this car good at first.

Edit: splits for a 1:24.7 now. I could go quicker with more practice as well.

Ok will have another proper look at the tune and see how it goes I don't mean to go on about it and I apologise if I have irritated anyone or any team but I support my team

I'm posting this here as well.

BigBen0913 wrote:We have had a look at the builds during the holiday break, and as I feel like the conflicting results during testing warrants more changes in the builds than what we can do at this time in good taste. I have come to the conclusion that we will finish the rest of the series with the builds as they are currently. I encourage that the drivers that are struggling with the BMW reach out to some of the faster guys for tuning help for the rest of the series