GT S9 Stewards Announcments

All Stewards Announcements will take place in this thread to save them getting lost in the middle of any General Discussion threads.

Stewards Public announcement:

Following Round 1 Race 2 Lobby C of the TORA GT Championship the following incident/s are under investigation by the stewards;
1) driver #340 SSRT Pronebird - Jump start
2)
3)
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Stewards Public announcement:

Following Round 1 Race 1 Lobby B of the TORA GT Championship the following incident/s are under investigation by the stewards;

1) driver #339 PLFSpurtle - Jump Start

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Stewards Public decision

Stewards Decision - Series: GT | Round 1 | Race: 1 | Lobby B

Incident involving driver #339 (PLFSpurtle) - Jump Start

Following investigation by the stewards, the following decision concerning the incident between driver #339 (PLFSpurtle) has been made.

It is the decision of the stewards that.......

Step 1 - 3 Race meeting caution:

A warning is given to a driver(s) when Stewards feel the driver(s) caused an unavoidable accident or driving wasn't up to TORA standards. The driver(s) then race under warning for 3 meetings. If driver(s) commit offences during that time the warning goes to points deductions and an additional 3 meeting warning period is added to the initial 3 race meetings.

Notes: It looks as though you misjudged the Start / finish line, and held off until the wrong one, by the second line, the actual start / finish line you had clearly overtaken. It's the drivers responsibility to know the track. However, whilst this was seen as unintentional, no place was relinquished. It is accepted no call for the place was made, but none should be needed.

Rules reminder: The Row in front can not be overtaken before the Start / Finish. A GT guide includes an explanation in this video:



Video evidence reviewed:




You have the option to appeal within 4 days of this decision

The Stewards Handbook and Stewards processes can be located here:
http://forums.theonlineracingassociation.com/t7297-definitive-stewarding-process
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Stewards Public decision

Stewards Decision - Series: GT | Round 1 | Race: 2 | Lobby C

Incident involving driver #340 SSRT Pronebird - Jump Start

Following investigation by the stewards, the following decision concerning the driver #340 SSRT Pronebird has been made.

It is the decision of the stewards that.......

Step 1 - *3 Race meeting caution:

A warning is given to a driver(s) when Stewards feel the driver(s) caused an unavoidable accident or driving wasn't up to TORA standards. The driver(s) then race under warning for 3 meetings. If driver(s) commit offences during that time the warning goes to points deductions and an additional 3 meeting warning period is added to the
initial 3 race meetings.

Notes: It is a drivers responsibility to read and understand the rules then driver accordingly whether the rules are as you would wish them or not.

Rules reminder: The Row in front can not be overtaken before the Start / Finish. A GT guide includes an explanation in this video:



Video evidence reviewed:




You have the option to appeal within 4 days of this decision

The Stewards Handbook and Stewards processes can be located here:
http://forums.theonlineracingassociation.com/t7297-definitive-stewarding-process
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Stewards Inquiry

Following Round 1 Race 1 Lobby A of the TORA GT Championship the following incident/s are under investigation by the stewards;

1) drivers #117 F4H Koenigsegg, #707 CQR MAGiC and #555 FMS BriSCA

both videos show both drivers doing nothing wrong.

Video one had one car not getting up to speed and falling back in formation before taking the green.

Video 2 showed a line of cars not get up to speed and falling out of formation before the green.

for granted the rules are plain and simple and the punishment is a light one. But for future reference, has seen in the videos. If one or more drivers fails hold their position while in formation and/or drops back(i.e. spun tires or brakes) before coming to the line(video 1) or causes a group of cars to slow down(video 2) prior to the line. And if the driver advancing position before the line does so to not only get up to speed as others did before or to avoid others drivers that are slowing and could potentially cause a wreck if the advancing driver is to slow down to hold position as stated in the rules.

I guess i'm looking for a clearer definition of the rule since both videos show the infracting driver getting up to speed and the other drivers not. And if the driver is to slow down to hold position as stated, a wreck could of occurred or the driver slowing to hold position is now at an disadvantage to all the cars in front of the driver cause one driver doesn't have proper start.

Also, to my opinion the second video showed evidence that a restart should of occured.

All Stewards Announcements will take place in this thread to save them getting lost in the middle of any General Discussion threads.

Stewards Inquiry
Following Round 1, Race 2, Lobby C, of the MSA TORA GT Championship the following incident/s are under investigation by the stewards;

1) Driver #268 (NoGoldie), driver #208 (XBR EGGY), driver #505 (S2M Jono), and driver #340 (SSRT Pronebird) - Jumping the start.

WCM Outlaw wrote:both videos show both drivers doing nothing wrong.

Video one had one car not getting up to speed and falling back in formation before taking the green.

Video 2 showed a line of cars not get up to speed and falling out of formation before the green.

for granted the rules are plain and simple and the punishment is a light one. But for future reference, has seen in the videos. If one or more drivers fails hold their position while in formation and/or drops back(i.e. spun tires or brakes) before coming to the line(video 1) or causes a group of cars to slow down(video 2) prior to the line. And if the driver advancing position before the line does so to not only get up to speed as others did before or to avoid others drivers that are slowing and could potentially cause a wreck if the advancing driver is to slow down to hold position as stated in the rules.

I guess i'm looking for a clearer definition of the rule since both videos show the infracting driver getting up to speed and the other drivers not. And if the driver is to slow down to hold position as stated, a wreck could of occurred or the driver slowing to hold position is now at an disadvantage to all the cars in front of the driver cause one driver doesn't have proper start.

Also, to my opinion the second video showed evidence that a restart should of occured.

This.

The rules were so clear about this, no overtaking before the start/finish line. In my eyes anyone caught overtaking before the start/finish line should be handed a 2 place grid penalty. 1 place for the car they overtook and a 2nd to stop this kind of thing occurring again, a warning seems a very light reprimand.

I had the same kind of incident in my race were I had a better start than the person directly in front off me, but because I knew the rules I backed off to stop myself from overtaking before the start/finish line.

the rules are clear but clearly both drivers weren't overtaking the car in front of them but the car besides them because those cars had fallen out of formation and failed to achieve a proper start.

In the second video, we did see one driver slow down to not overtake the car in front of him but he then jumped to the outside to avoid getting rear ended or hitting the car in front of him, which this almost caused an accident with the car behind.

Again slowing down or braking to just hold position can cause accidents as ppl are trying to get up to speed behind them.

Not to pull American sanctioning bodies into things here, but they (NASCAR, Grand-Am, IRL, SCCA)'d never punish anyone for passing the car next to the on a double-file rolling start.

Your responsibility is the car in front of you. The responsibility of the person in 2nd place is to make sure the guy starting first is the first car to cross the line. If someone mid-pack is screwing with people, or the line of the car starting 2nd isn't moving, that's no one's true fault because all rules involved were adhered to.

I understand NOW the ruling completely. It is a shame that it took not only a non-clarification in the forums in general discussion:

PLFSpurtle wrote:I have a rulebook question:

1): I was wondering what the definition of overtake is.

The reason I ask is if on a start, if I get along side of someone before the line, but do not improve my position (i.e. his nose is still in front of mine), is this considered overtaking before the line? Must we stay single-file before the start line, or can we utilize any moment we may have and pull along side the car in front?

Every series rules are different. I just want to make sure I stay within the rulebook.

Thanks!

WWR Aero wrote:

1) You're fine to get as far alongside as you can, before taking the position. If for instance, you're meant to start 2nd, and just before the line you take 1st by a whisker, that's not allowed and will be penalised or at the very least you have to back off and immediately allow him back though, therefore ruining your momentum.

No where in this explanation, the rulebook, or the video-guide did this refer to separate rows of the grid.

It did take an inquiry (in which the outcome necessitated a warning) in order for me to understand the rule. I will abide by it from now on. In the future I will be sure to slow down for slower traffic and still maintain a safe gap from all the cars around me.

I would simply like to point out that F4H Diablo qualified with a faster time than I, had a very decent start, and was unable to beat me to the start / finish line (as the replay clearly shows and that which I have already conceded) in a completely different lane, on the next row of the grid.

Also, I understand the spirit of the rule. I believe it is to not have any unsafe activity entering turn one. To prevent the "win it in the first corner" phenomenon. In this instance, I believe it was safer for me to maintain my momentum than to let off and risk the 8 cars behind me having to unnecessarily do the same, as my teammate's replay clearly shows. In the future, however, I will be sure to do so, because I cannot risk losing points under my warning status.

For the future, can this special set of circumstances please be clarified for us new-comers in the rulebook? I would hate for the next person to come along and have the same instance happen to them.

Hailfire97x wrote:Not to pull American sanctioning bodies into things here, but they (NASCAR, Grand-Am, IRL, SCCA)'d never punish anyone for passing the car next to the on a double-file rolling start.

yeah they do punish people for jumping the start...keep in mind they are using a flag system too... IRL dosent even let people block, NASCAR throws yellows for pieces of paper on the road...why should we listen to them?

whole thing could be avoided with standing starts

WCM Outlaw wrote:both videos show both drivers doing nothing wrong.

Video one had one car not getting up to speed and falling back in formation before taking the green.

Video 2 showed a line of cars not get up to speed and falling out of formation before the green.

for granted the rules are plain and simple and the punishment is a light one. But for future reference, has seen in the videos. If one or more drivers fails hold their position while in formation and/or drops back(i.e. spun tires or brakes) before coming to the line(video 1) or causes a group of cars to slow down(video 2) prior to the line. And if the driver advancing position before the line does so to not only get up to speed as others did before or to avoid others drivers that are slowing and could potentially cause a wreck if the advancing driver is to slow down to hold position as stated in the rules.

I guess i'm looking for a clearer definition of the rule since both videos show the infracting driver getting up to speed and the other drivers not. And if the driver is to slow down to hold position as stated, a wreck could of occurred or the driver slowing to hold position is now at an disadvantage to all the cars in front of the driver cause one driver doesn't have proper start.

Also, to my opinion the second video showed evidence that a restart should of occured.

i dont think we're watching the same videos.

btw, easiest way to avoid this is to just have standing starts.

idk about the official american series, but i never seen guys get penalized for for passing the car thats next to them(in the other row) but i've seen it happen when a car in the right lane pulls right and passes the car directly in front of them before the line and they get penalized.

All i'm saying(and asking for clarification) is if a car in the right lane is clearly falling out of formation, slowing or off pace (and causes cars behind it to slow immensely or brake. Even potentially causing a wreck). does the car in the left have to slow down and/or brake to "not advance" position which would potentially cause accidents or now be at a disadvantage to the other cars that actually did stay in formation correctly and get up to speed properly.

I still see video 2 showing evidence that a restart should of occurred and that no driver is at fault except the one that failed to either get up to speed properly for w/e reasons.

Travis, which one you mean??

WCM Outlaw wrote:idk about the official american series, but i never seen guys get penalized for for passing the car thats next to them(in the other row) but i've seen it happen when a car in the right lane pulls right and passes the car directly in front of them before the line and they get penalized.

All i'm saying(and asking for clarification) is if a car in the right lane is clearly falling out of formation, slowing or off pace (and causes cars behind it to slow immensely or brake. Even potentially causing a wreck). does the car in the left have to slow down and/or brake to "not advance" position which would potentially cause accidents or now be at a disadvantage to the other cars that actually did stay in formation correctly and get up to speed properly.

I still see video 2 showing evidence that a restart should of occurred and that no driver is at fault except the one that failed to either get up to speed properly for w/e reasons.

If someone is intentionally standing on the brakes and causing havoc behind them, then that should be looked at by itself.

In NASCAR you will not get a penalty for passing a car on the separate row UNLESS it is the leader. I have gotten that rule clarified by NASCAR via email to clarify a ruling in another series. Yes you can email them and get a response. For example if the 2nd place driver spins his/her tires and gets passed by the 3rd place driver in the other row then it is a legal move. However as this isn't NASCAR and it is a TORA series they have the right to make whatever rulings they want. I just wanted to clarify my understanding of a double file start.

WCM Outlaw wrote:Travis, which one you mean??

the last one.

Travis, video 2 showed the cars in the left lane "stacking up" due to a car not getting a proper start and nearly causing a wreck. SSRT Pronebird only did what was correct and that was getting up to speed. But that video does show a restart needed to occur.

Video 1 showed the car in the left lane slow down, out of formation to where it was along side the wrong car PLF and when the green dropped both driver picked up speed properly. But if the white car had maintained is position he would of never been overtaken before the line, also if PLF had slowed to give that position back he could of caused an accident from the cars behind that are now up to speed.

Thanks F4H Insanity for that helpful insight. And that is how i've always managed a double file start

WCM Outlaw wrote:

All i'm saying(and asking for clarification) is if a car in the right lane is clearly falling out of formation, slowing or off pace (and causes cars behind it to slow immensely or brake. Even potentially causing a wreck). does the car in the left have to slow down and/or brake to "not advance" position which would potentially cause accidents or now be at a disadvantage to the other cars that actually did stay in formation correctly and get up to speed properly.

BG Smithy wrote:
I had the same kind of incident in my race were I had a better start than the person directly in front off me, but because I knew the rules I backed off to stop myself from overtaking before the start/finish line.

them's the rules.

WCM Outlaw wrote:Travis, video 2 showed the cars in the left lane "stacking up" due to a car not getting a proper start and nearly causing a wreck. SSRT Pronebird only did what was correct and that was getting up to speed.

no, he should have held position, because there is no overtaking before the start finish line.

then like you said. have another start and save the replay and say "these guys were weaving all over the road before the original start"

Travis, Smithy backed off from the guy directly in front him not because the guy to his left/right didn't get a good start. Passing the guy in front before the line is obviously clear and a no go, but both videos are of guys "advancing" cuz of drivers in the opposite lane a) didn't maintain position in formation, and b) slowed significantly and even nearly caused an accident.

But regardless of what happened race 1 lobby B should of had a restart period, whether SSRT advanced or not. Personally i think the restart not occuring is the real issue with that incident.