TORA TEC 12 hours of Silverstone General Discussion

XPR Soundwave wrote:rumors are, and i hope they are true.....

TCC cars.... fingers crossed

and Production GT cars... double fingers crossed

then again i've been wrong before hehe

My guess is TORA GT and TCC

TORA GT of course.... but season 8 cars was what i was referring to. the current cars are much over used. And honestly, the season 8 cars were the best.

XPR Soundwave wrote:TORA GT of course.... but season 8 cars was what i was referring to. the current cars are much over used. And honestly, the season 8 cars were the best.

I think it could be GT3 cars.

I won't bother if it's GT3. Doubt the Corvette would be good.

the race built cars are used in everything now since they were introduced in GT S9, and the S8 cars fell off the map. i always thought those cars were well balanced and provided the best variety while still being balanced.

of course, the community has gotten much faster now. and we seem to always find the dominate car, and something wrong with balancing lol but i think bringing those cars back in the final events at TORA on FM4 would be a great way to close this very successful chapter.

XPR Soundwave wrote:the race built cars are used in everything now since they were introduced in GT S9, and the S8 cars fell off the map. i always thought those cars were well balanced and provided the best variety while still being balanced.

of course, the community has gotten much faster now. and we seem to always find the dominate car, and something wrong with balancing lol but i think bringing those cars back in the final events at TORA on FM4 would be a great way to close this very successful chapter.

don't steal my ideas!!!
had something planned for November...

Simple solution: find the best two cars in GT Season 8 and kill one, neuter the other. Problem solved, race on.

Same goes for the TCC cars, kill the Megane and castrate the Honda.

here's what i'm hoping.

some sort of massively restricted gentleman spec radical class. really slow prototypes...or something like that.

gen3ral ts0 wrote:here's what i'm hoping.

some sort of massively restricted gentleman spec radical class. really slow prototypes...or something like that.

I'm usually good at detecting sarcasm, but in this case I am quite unsure.  

or use last years list?

The season 8 cars where not fun to race against one another. You usually had a power build vs a handling build. The season 9 cars using the actual "race" cars provides better racing IMO. Hope its the same as last year.

Flyin Mikey J wrote:

gen3ral ts0 wrote:here's what i'm hoping.

some sort of massively restricted gentleman spec radical class. really slow prototypes...or something like that.

I'm usually good at detecting sarcasm, but in this case I am quite unsure.  

I'm not joking. Gentlemen only.

I cant wait im going to drive GT's either way as it hit my comfort zone on how I drive

Flyin Mikey J wrote:Simple solution: find the best two cars in GT Season 8 and kill one, neuter the other. Problem solved, race on.

Same goes for the TCC cars, kill the Megane and castrate the Honda.

Why? Because CQR turned them into race winning cars again? Seriously, change the record this is getting *so* old now.

TCC S6 - CQR win the title in the Kia c'eed - people moan its too quick, despite no one else winning anything in it.
GT S9 - CQR win the teams title in Jag - it gets nerfed more than the drivers title winning car
GT S10 - CQR drivers win the title in Aston - it gets nerfed for TEC, despite the BMW, Lambo and others being equally competitive
TCC S7 - CQR win the title in Megane and many races in the Honda, and yet other teams in same cars win nothing.

For the record, the Megane and Honda's may have appeared dominant, but that was down to tuning and skill of the drivers - many other cars that were capable of winning races (Seat, BMW, DS4), heck I was even leading A lobby at Suzuka in the god awful Veloster until I gifted the win to my team mate who needed the points for the title. So to single out the cars that a team made competitive makes me angry and annoyed. Check out the curent 'Hatch 22 Community Rivals' and you'll see all our top touring car drivers dominating the leaderboards, that's the real reason why the Megane and Honda won in the TCC this season.

Sorry for the long post, just uninformed nonsense comments like that really grinds my gears.

CQR MAGiC wrote:

Flyin Mikey J wrote:Simple solution: find the best two cars in GT Season 8 and kill one, neuter the other. Problem solved, race on.

Same goes for the TCC cars, kill the Megane and castrate the Honda.

Why? Because CQR turned them into race winning cars again? Seriously, change the record this is getting *so* old now.

TCC S6 - CQR win the title in the Kia c'eed - people moan its too quick, despite no one else winning anything in it.
GT S9 - CQR win the teams title in Jag - it gets nerfed more than the drivers title winning car
GT S10 - CQR drivers win the title in Aston - it gets nerfed for TEC, despite the BMW, Lambo and others being equally competitive
TCC S7 - CQR win the title in Megane and many races in the Honda, and yet other teams in same cars win nothing.

For the record, the Megane and Honda's may have appeared dominant, but that was down to tuning and skill of the drivers - many other cars that were capable of winning races (Seat, BMW, DS4), heck I was even leading A lobby at Suzuka in the god awful Veloster until I gifted the win to my team mate who needed the points for the title. So to single out the cars that a team made competitive makes me angry and annoyed. Check out the curent 'Hatch 22 Community Rivals' and you'll see all our top touring car drivers dominating the leaderboards, that's the real reason why the Megane and Honda won in the TCC this season.

Sorry for the long post, just uninformed nonsense comments like that really grinds my gears.

i KNOW i am not the quickest driver but i completely agree!
yes there is fast cars at tracks (Porsche at Sebring, Vette at Le Mans, Lambo at Laguna etc) but majority of the time it comes purely down to driver skill and tuning ability, that's why i don't like seeing cars being neutered when a CQR, F4H, VVV, TG, CRA, XPR or any other letter combination driver gets into a car and dominates it, and they could've done that with any other car no matter what

i thought that's what made those cars great. i loved racing in them and was very sad when the switch was made. i had car quick in the straights but poor handling, so i had to work hard to keep up in the corners and make a good run to finally use the speed. but the battles lasted for laps of side by side racing. where now, side-by-side is few and far. and in multiple lobbies we saw single file, hot lap sessions unless one guy made a mistake and got passed. there wasn't really a weak point btw cars that could give another the edge.

keep in mind, i've always preferred cars that weren't balanced to each other but that the tracks balanced them. I'm just bored with the current GT cars, that's all. i'll race whatever the staff allow, but was just saying i hope its something slightly different than what they have been using.

CQR MAGiC wrote:

Flyin Mikey J wrote:Simple solution: find the best two cars in GT Season 8 and kill one, neuter the other. Problem solved, race on.

Same goes for the TCC cars, kill the Megane and castrate the Honda.

Why? Because CQR turned them into race winning cars again? Seriously, change the record this is getting *so* old now.

TCC S7 - CQR win the title in Megane and many races in the Honda, and yet other teams in same cars win nothing.

For the record, the Megane and Honda's may have appeared dominant, but that was down to tuning and skill of the drivers - many other cars that were capable of winning races (Seat, BMW, DS4), heck I was even leading A lobby at Suzuka in the god awful Veloster until I gifted the win to my team mate who needed the points for the title. So to single out the cars that a team made competitive makes me angry and annoyed. Check out the curent 'Hatch 22 Community Rivals' and you'll see all our top touring car drivers dominating the leaderboards, that's the real reason why the Megane and Honda won in the TCC this season.

Being in the Volvo S60, I was never close enough to the A Lobby of TCC to know who was in what... but in NATCC there was a two-three second gap between XPR's Meganes and the rest of the field... including a member of COR in a car other than Megane/Civic. Properly balanced cars driven by some of the best racers on Forza (as well as the "uninformed" like myself) should not see two second gaps between marques.

I know you guys are quick... but I also know that not everyone who was quick in the Meganes are not that much quicker than the field in anything else. 

Flyin Mikey J wrote:Properly balanced cars driven by some of the best racers on Forza (as well as the  "uninformed" like myself) should not see two second gaps between marques.

There wasn't 2 second gaps between marques. Most of the TCC A lobby saw 8 to 10 different marquees covered by less than 0.5s - it was the closest touring car series I've ever been part of. As part of the TCC test team (along with many other clubs/teams), I drove over 300 laps in all 30+ cars, and at most there was a 0.8s difference between the 'best' and 'worst' cars (and the Megane was not the best either). The fact you were 2 sec+ off the pace of a Megane was because you were driving 2 sec+ slower, not because your car was 2 seconds slower. I've checked Round 1 of the NATCC as an example - my STOCK time in a Volvo S60 (no tuning) was a 1.35.316 - that would have put the STOCK car 2nd on the grid for the race. You qualified 3.6s slower than that, a 1.38.936, in the same car, so your build, tuning and/or driving were the reason for being seconds off the pace. My own testing times in the 30 cars, with stock tunes, would have put EVERY SINGLE car 2nd or 3rd on the grid for the NATCC round, with no tuning - even the worst car (Volvo C30 - 1.36.1). My own car, the Hyundai Veloster, was only my '23rd quickest' car in testing, but was still good enough to qualify 4th and fight for race wins by the end of the season.

You're part of the TORA Community team, do you not think it's disrepectful to undermine the efforts of the testing team, and the drivers and competitors who took part in a very closely fought championship? A lack of competition and big variation in driving talent was the reason for '2 second' differences in the NATCC, not unbalanced cars. The TCC, which used the same cars, was decided on the final lap of the final race, and 4 different cars finished in top 4 at the end of the championship (Megane, DS4, Honda, Seat). Singling out fast drivers and teams who know how to build, tune and drive these cars to the limit is not the right way to balance cars for a championship - drivers from XPR, CQR, TG etc could have got any car on the TCC/NATCC entry list into the A lobby. It's no coincidence that the same teams and drivers consistently end up in the 'best' cars - they make them the best cars, through optimising the car build, tuning and driving skill.

CQR MAGiC wrote:

Flyin Mikey J wrote:Properly balanced cars driven by some of the best racers on Forza (as well as the  "uninformed" like myself) should not see two second gaps between marques.

There wasn't 2 second gaps between marques. Most of the TCC A lobby saw 8 to 10 different marquees covered by less than 0.5s - it was the closest touring car series I've ever been part of. As part of the TCC test team (along with many other clubs/teams), I drove over 300 laps in all 30+ cars, and at most there was a 0.8s difference between the 'best' and 'worst' cars (and the Megane was not the best either). The fact you were 2 sec+ off the pace of a Megane was because you were driving 2 sec+ slower, not because your car was 2 seconds slower. I've checked Round 1 of the NATCC as an example - my STOCK time in a Volvo S60 (no tuning) was a 1.35.316 - that would have put the STOCK car 2nd on the grid for the race. You qualified 3.6s slower than that, a 1.38.936, in the same car, so your build, tuning and/or driving were the reason for being seconds off the pace. My own testing times in the 30 cars, with stock tunes, would have put EVERY SINGLE car 2nd or 3rd on the grid for the NATCC round, with no tuning - even the worst car (Volvo C30 - 1.36.1). My own car, the Hyundai Veloster, was only my '23rd quickest' car in testing, but was still good enough to qualify 4th and fight for race wins by the end of the season.

You're part of the TORA Community team, do you not think it's disrepectful to undermine the efforts of the testing team, and the drivers and competitors who took part in a very closely fought championship? A lack of competition and big variation in driving talent was the reason for '2 second' differences in the NATCC, not unbalanced cars. The TCC, which used the same cars, was decided on the final lap of the final race, and 4 different cars finished in top 4 at the end of the championship (Megane, DS4, Honda, Seat). Singling out fast drivers and teams who know how to build, tune and drive these cars to the limit is not the right way to balance cars for a championship - drivers from XPR, CQR, TG etc could have got any car on the TCC/NATCC entry list into the A lobby. It's no coincidence that the same teams and drivers consistently end up in the 'best' cars - they make them the best cars, through optimising the car build, tuning and driving skill.

+1 Magic, TCC car lists is closet car list we have ever produced without having to mod a game

TCC car lists is fine end of

Car List for the TCC was good. I didn't test any of the cars I just chose the BMW 1M because it was RWD & looked like a touring car. It was a bitch to drive due to limitations on the build but it was good enough to fight the CQR boys at the few tracks I did and I even managed an A lobby win

Yeah, Sebring Short was an awesome round, must have been 6 different cars battling it out for the wins there. It's *really* hard to fairly balance the RWD cars in with the FWD - make them fractionally too fast and they easily become dominant (e.g. gaining 4-6 places off the start and still having same race pace as FWD) -then all the top teams and drivers want to switch to RWD cars, rendering 80% of the car list redundant. I think S7 balance was about as good as we can get within the limitations Forza gives us - RWD cars quick enough to get in A lobby, and then use their start advantage to be in contention for podiums.

So...What actually is the other class? Definitely TORA GT S10 Specs?

Top Class will be GT, second class will be TCC. TCC will use the Season 8 rules, which are effectively Season 7 with a few tweaks. GT class is still being tested, it will either be an adjusted S9/S10 ruleset, or something more akin to GTE.

Sounds great

Well there is the car list lol time to start testing