Re: Timing Board

by AMR of the Apex Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 15:00

hmmm, ok then, just me. 3.41

by **ATR DAN** Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 16:29

WWR Aero wrote:For those of us in the Nissan, it would be very helpful if some of the other GT1 entrants would post some rough comparative lap times so that we can more accurately guage what power handicap to put on the unrestricted version (if any).

I'm running inconsistant times at the moment, but somewhere between 3:33 (fluke) and 3:35s.

I'm no where near your time at the minute. My best was a 3:39.xxx so far. I think its made the GT1 Category confusing adding a GT500 Spec Nissan in. Why they did in the first place, I don't know.
Thats a good question actually! I know its a bit late for me to ask but why did you guys add a Japanese GT500 Spec car in a category for GT1 cars only???? Suspect

Oh well, if I can't beat the Nissans at le mans, I'll take the pride of finishing first in GT1..........in a GT1 car. Either myself or Switch will.......hopefully!

by nickyf1 Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 16:43

Are the nissans unrestricted?

by AMR of the Apex Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 16:53

DAN 2605 wrote:I'm no where near your time at the minute. My best was a 3:39.xxx so far. I think its made the GT1 Category confusing adding a GT500 Spec Nissan in. Why they did in the first place, I don't know.
Thats a good question actually! I know its a bit late for me to ask but why did you guys add a Japanese GT500 Spec car in a category for GT1 cars only????

Oh well, if I can't beat the Nissans at le mans, I'll take the pride of finishing first in GT1..........in a GT1 car. Either myself or Switch will.......hopefully!

Because Nissan are in FIA GT1 this year?

by nickyf1 Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 17:48

Yeah, but those Nissans are Super GT, GT500 class spec, i.e they corner far better than the GT1 cars.

Unrestricting them is like giving them similar power to the GT1's but having more grip, which is silly...

by AMR of the Apex Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 17:55

well I'm in a skyline and I've been doing my testing with 5% handling handicap, so dont worry about me.

by **ATR DAN** Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 18:36

nickyf1 wrote:Are the nissans unrestricted?

They've had their restrictors taken off.

ADx Garage wrote:Because Nissan are in FIA GT1 this year?

You're right. But unfortunately, its not the right Nissan GT-R because this game doesn't have the real Nissan GT1 Machine. So instead for some reason the guys here decided that the Japanese GT500 Spec version should be used instead. Its dominated most of the races so far in the LMS because of it's superior handling. And now that they have taken the restrictors off for le mans, they are going to have a big and unfair advantage compared to those using GT1 machinery.

by WWR Chillz Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 18:48

I believe that is why, we are asking for people to submit some GT1 times, so we can get a fair balance. If we apply a 5% power handicap or something similar we maybe able to balance it out, but we need info from other GT1 runners.

by WWR Chillz Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 18:52

I will also build some other GT1 cars up to compare if I get time, so I can guage what is fair and balanced, because over such a long lap, driver skill can play a huge part. Eg. If a fast driver posts a 3:33 and a slower driver posts a 3:41 in the same car, what should happen? If you slow that car up, it will penalise the slower driver, but if you speed it up, the fast driver gets an advantage. The cars need to be even, so driver skill is what sets them apart, not superior machines.

by lfcnicklfc Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 18:53

I like how you're discussing the ideas of balancing with power etc but why didnt things like this happen for rounds such as Sebring and Mugello where at Mugello you had a major advantage and vice versa at Le Mans and at Road America it shouldnt just be done for one event.

by WWR Chillz Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 18:56

It's because we are running unrestricted. It gives us too big an advantage I think. I haven't built the other cars yet. Also this is a stand alone event, not part of a series. In the CER, the Porsche's were allowed to run unrestricted at Le Mans to help balance the cars.

by WWR Chillz Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 19:00

Also, we don't expect to run unrestricted at Road America. We know we will get hammered down the straights.
I am happy to run either way. I will try restricted to see what times I can do. Should be a challenge. I will post my times later this evening. I just want a reasonably close battle with someone.

by **CQR Aero** Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 19:34

lfcnicklfc wrote:I like how you're discussing the ideas of balancing with power etc but why didnt things like this happen for rounds such as Sebring and Mugello where at Mugello you had a major advantage and vice versa at Le Mans and at Road America it shouldnt just be done for one event.

We've been running restricted cars at all other meetings. You say we've had the advantage, but if you look at the results you'll see that that is not true. The only tracks we had a significant advantage on were Mugello and Suzuka. At the others we were creamed for speed and had to drive out of our (/my) skins to keep up. After all, it's far easier to pass on the straights, where you guys have a massive advantage, than on the corners cleanly.

The only reason I am leading the driver's championship is because I've attended every meeting.

by lfcnicklfc Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 19:47

I didnt specifically say you had an advantage you had an advantage at certain tracks just like with the other cars and i love how you threw in that you were leading the championship lol Razz

by **CQR Aero** Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 20:31

I meant leading the class in the championship, and I didn't want you to see that and say "well you're leading because your car is faster than everyone elses" becuase it simply isn't. I'm only in that position due to turning up to every meeting and scoring reasonably well. Don't forget that the GTR was the perceived slowest car going into the season, which was partly the reason I wanted to drive it - to take the "underdog" and make the best possible of it (something I plan to do with my car choices for the second half of the year too).

by WWR Chillz Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 20:40

lfcnick is running 3:36's in the Aston. I can run 3:45's in the GTR restricted, so I think something needs to be done. Don't forget the Aston is unrestricted, therefore has over 200bhp more than the Nissan. If lfcnick and Dan could build up a GTR unrestricted and run a few laps with a 5% power handicap and see what times they can do in comparison. Or maybe 10% power handicap. I will try 10% tonight and post times. I certainly do not want an unfair advantage, but I do not want to be 9 seconds a lap slower than the aston's. It would bore me to tears.

by lfcnicklfc Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 20:42

I race in P2 by the way so there's no point and when did i run a 3.36 haha Razz

by **CQR Aero** Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 20:50

Try a handling handicap as opposed to a power one.

by WWR Chillz Mon 5 Jul 2010 - 20:55

It's on the leaderboards nick! Laughing

General did a 3.37 in the Corvette on his 3rd lap, so if we can get the GTR to lap at about that sort of level, it should balance the field. If we can get the cars to lap within a second or 2 of each other, it would make for some great racing. We all want that don't we?

by WWR Chillz Tue 6 Jul 2010 - 0:07

Ok boys. I have been testing a lot tonight.
I think the best solution for the GTR is to run unrestricted, but have a 10% power handicap which removes 66.5 bhp. Horsepower is now 598 instead of 665.
This however isn't enough to balance the times, so a further 5% handicap to the front grip and also a 5% handicap to the rear grip does balance the times. I can now dip into the 3:37's with a very good lap. To me this seems the fairest way to do it.
-10% Power Handicap
-5% Front Grip Handicap
-5% Rear Grip Handicap

Aero hasn't tried it yet, so I will get feedback from him soon.
What do guys think to that??? Ok or not?

by **LMR DarthMario** Tue 6 Jul 2010 - 0:14

that does sound fair, but my tuning skills for R-class cars suuuccckkk. today i pulled my DBR9 out of the garage and only mustered a mid 3:41. Sad

i may have to try the default tune in a bit

by WWR Chillz Tue 6 Jul 2010 - 0:39

General ran a 3.38 in the Aston and a 3.37 in the Corvette. Maybe he could help you out. lfcnick ran a 3.36 in the Aston, maybe he could help you out a little as well. I really want this race to be close, otherwise 2.4 hours of solo racing is boring.
So, i think I have balanced the GTR quite well comparing to the times that have been posted. It is not the quickest nor the slowest. I don't know what Aero will say about this. But, I do not want an unfair advantage. I am here to race.

by **LMR DarthMario** Tue 6 Jul 2010 - 0:50

i can almost prove my terrible r-class tuning. Razz

i just took my tune back out and was able to get a 3:40.5xx. then reset everything back to default and hit a 3:39.866 and the default tune handles the Porsche Curves far better than mine. Sad

im amazed the amount of time you can lose or gain around here

by AMR of the Apex Tue 6 Jul 2010 - 10:01

WWR Chillz wrote:Ok boys. I have been testing a lot tonight.
I think the best solution for the GTR is to run unrestricted, but have a 10% power handicap which removes 66.5 bhp. Horsepower is now 598 instead of 665.
This however isn't enough to balance the times, so a further 5% handicap to the front grip and also a 5% handicap to the rear grip does balance the times. I can now dip into the 3:37's with a very good lap. To me this seems the fairest way to do it.
-10% Power Handicap
-5% Front Grip Handicap
-5% Rear Grip Handicap

Aero hasn't tried it yet, so I will get feedback from him soon.
What do guys think to that??? Ok or not?

In that case I'm definately out then, I'm 4 seconds a lap slower than everyone else without the 10% engine strangling.

by WWR Chillz Tue 6 Jul 2010 - 10:06

What times are you doing?

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