TCC Season 7 (Q1 2013) Testing - Phase 1 Closed

I think the front aero helps combat the understeer, and once tuned, these are what I call proper touring cars! Some of last years were more like high-end 250bhp road cars, whereas these feel a lot more racy, and probably much closer to the latest NGTC spec BTCC cars. Individual PIs aren't worth the effort - and can actually lead to more disagreements than they try to solve, cos there's an implied 'order' that car x must be quicker than car y because it's PI was set lower, too many variables to be that specific so a flat PI for each group works better IMO.

I wouldn't like to go down the route of giving specific cars their own penalty or limit group. If the don't fit, they should be dropped. There's plenty else to choose from.

I'll try the FR-s myself to see what I think. Interestingly, compared to Worm's opinion, I was surprised at the RCZ as it set almost the exact same time as the Insignia for me. I still need to do a lot more yet though, but some kind of GT picture scrapbook doohicky seems to have sucked last week into a black hole of "it never happened".

Could we try the 06 Focus ST? I love that car and feel it should get tested.

Great work there Magic I'm in the 36s for most of the cars but have found RWD much easyer to drive.

We could, however we do already have the 2013, and the RS.

I feel the 06 ST could replace the RS, theres two Golf GTis so why not have 2 STs? And another quick question why no Seat Leon 03?

I wanted to use the latest versions of all the cars that we have, so it is modern TCC. The only older cars are the Lexus and Integra, mainly because they are TCC stalwarts and give a bit more options for RWD.

Thing with this approach however is that many cars on the list are DLC, and not everyone has the DLC.

The Golfs are only on the initial list, with the Mk5 being pretty slow it will probably be dropped, along with the Scirocco GT if the R is as good as it seems to be.

You raise a good point Richy. It might be a good idea to mark up which ones are "standard game" and which are dlc cars.

but you have a 2002 Honda

Its not agruement its just the St 06 and Cupra 03 have been two great cars in the past. Ill do a sneaky test with them just to see were why would be. Ill post my times up tonight for all cars at the Hock.

I can mark up what isn't DLC easily enough, I can only access the standard cars out here as I have no connection to XBL to allow me to use any DLC.

The 2003 SEAT is a monster, we had to drop it and the Renault Clio because they were too fast. The 06 and 03 Focus' didn't get enough grip so we cut them early.

The RCZ was more than 5 tenths off the other cars I tested. It's a pig and just doesn't accelerate. I'll try to run the FWD on the controller but imagine this is going to be really ugly.

I was the same worm, I haven't used a controller for years (since the start of FM3) and it takes awhile to get used to.

Richy, I've used one in one race since I started playing. I got a wheel 2 weeks after I got Forza and learned to play on one. It murders my hands, I can play CoD for hours but Forza kills them in 10 laps.

Yeah it's weird, I felt my hands getting sore as I was gripping the controller so much and pushing into it. Can't wait to get back on a wheel.

I can't do this!!!

I'm more than 2 seconds off and run off the track frequently. I couldn't even do Road America in my grip tuned car for Classics within 2.5 seconds of my time and my first 4 laps were between 5 and 9 seconds slower than what I was averaging on the wheel.

I'd be doing you guys a disservice by submitting times for this. I can help with optimizing builds and such once the restrictions get narrowed down. Sorry guys, support did contact me so it will be around 2-4 weeks depending on when I get my RMA. Takes 5 days to ship it there.

Don't worry worm, your help has been invaluable so far and if you find any build irregularities or have any pointers then just share them

Richy59 wrote:Don't worry worm, your help has been invaluable so far and if you find any build irregularities or have any pointers then just share them

totally agree dude

Good to hear, I always wonder if I come across as pushy because I just type what I think. I'll continue to monitor this and fool around with the cars.

I don't know if Magic and the rest agree but once initial testing is done I would find very good builds for each car, pick the heaviest of the bunch and set the maximum weight at that. It would eliminate people from finding builds and also building a car "wrong". Maybe teaching them how to do things better in the process. Example if the VW weighs 2534 then max weight is 2600 (random numbers)

as far as i know, one of the Four Civic Type-R's i built, i managed to get 325bhp into it, but to compensate the power, it weighs 2,897lbs, and there's alot of throttle-steer, for me anyways. the other 3 have less power, so i hope the throttle-steer isnt as bad.

Shouldnt we leave the weights incase drivers want to add power for certain tracks?

No, that means one car could gain a large advantage over another on a certain track when it still competes at the others. If you eliminate variables you can balance the cars. If you don't eliminate them one car can gain an advantage over another that doesn't have the same build change options.

I checked my lowest cars at 2500 and it seemed to level the field a bit, by the numbers anyway. Cars had to sacrifice weight or a bit of power to keep the grip, and vice versa. I think it's the way to go as the cars seem to be pretty solid otherwise and we have a great selection of cars and non seem to be overly dominant. Kinda wish the slower cars were about 0.5s off the pace rather than 1 second though.

Interesting....I've not heard good things about the Alfa, yet so far it's my fastest car....! (Admitedly I've only tested a handful).

CQR Aero wrote:Interesting....I've not heard good things about the Alfa, yet so far it's my fastest car....! (Admitedly I've only tested a handful).

It has a lot of natural grip. When we tested Stock Hatch it was initially fast until we started running the cars and getting adapted. I don't think you can tune much time into it like you can some others. It was still really fun to drive. It's possible you could get it to work, albeit on the lower end of things.

Richy59 wrote:I checked my lowest cars at 2500 and it seemed to level the field a bit, by the numbers anyway. Cars had to sacrifice weight or a bit of power to keep the grip, and vice versa. I think it's the way to go as the cars seem to be pretty solid otherwise and we have a great selection of cars and non seem to be overly dominant. Kinda wish the slower cars were about 0.5s off the pace rather than 1 second though.

The tighter you can get the weight range, the closer the power-to-weight ratios will be for the cars which will naturally help balance them (few other sites like VTCC calculate power-to-weight ratios when balancing cars). Reminds me of last season, at Mugello Club the Kia was struggling a bit for speed due to the long straight and CQR Champion built me a new one which went about 0.5s quicker and I thought fantastic... til I checked the build and it was about 50lbs under the minimum weight (he didn't know the full regs), so a 2,500lb minimum will certainly help reduce the build permutations.

How about RWD weight limts? They seem to be pretty good.